Talk: Barry Allen (Earth-1)

Savitar

Since Barry was Savitar at one point, wouldn't it make sense to include an image of Savitar on the image tabs? Just wondering WyronX22 (talk) 22:41, May 27, 2019 (UTC)

I would agree with this, Savitar did exist in the present day (same with She-cada) and there is no page for him.Schroeswald (talk) 22:48, May 27, 2019 (UTC)

I actually added it once back in October, but MakeShift undid it.Ninja72 (talk) 11:44, May 28, 2019 (UTC)

Honestly, I feel it'd be reasonable for Savitar-Barry to have his own separate page, mostly because he's a character completely separate from Flash-Barry. Sddelano5 (talk) 23:21, June 2, 2019 (UTC)

IIRC He did Once Upon a time, it was merged to fit with how we’ve treated alternate timelines and time remnants before.Schroeswald (talk) 01:43, June 3, 2019 (UTC)

Yeah. I remember that. But, by my opinion, they could have separate pages because they're technically two different characters. Sddelano5 (talk) 02:10, June 3, 2019 (UTC)

Not to revive the discussion, but I learned the admins recently agreed that characters with multiple identities would only have the current one (Earth-2 Laurel's Black Siren pic was removed, because of that), with the exceptions of Mick as Chronos, since due to time travel the identity is still active, and also Hunter Zolomon, since he did not become Black Flash willingly. I think what makes Savitar different from Chronos is that the version of Barry, who became Savitar was erased from existence, which would make the identity inactive.Ninja72 (talk) 07:34, August 14, 2019 (UTC)

I gotta disagree. I feel Savitar is different enough from Barry to warrant his own page as well as keeping the current inforamtion on the current page Lordpkeravrium (talk) 22:19, December 16, 2019 (UTC)

Ok I know I'm very late to the discussion but if character images are based on whether they're active or not, it should be noted that Savitar is essentially in the same situation as Chronos because he's a frequent time traveler as well. (Yes he's erased but he can still appear after that point, see "The Reverse-Flash Returns".) The only difference is that Savitar's activity ended with him being erased while Chronos' ended with him turning back to normal Mick. But they were both still "terminated" in some way. However I don't really care about the image decisions either way, I just wanted to add my 2 cents because I find the topic interesting. Wikifan988 (talk) 08:10, June 3, 2020 (UTC)

What is the final decision on the Savitar debate? I feel it should be separated. I went to the category "Mythology" and saw Barry Allen, only to realize that "Savitar" is a mythological god. But I feel that it would have been more direct if Savitar was in the category instead of Barry. Bottom line: what was the final decision and should this section be closed? Bratpack2 (talk) 22:50, August 15, 2020 (UTC)

This section was not even about the separation, it was about whether he should have the image in the infobox or not. But, yeah, they have decided to split it again after that Zari situation on Legends happened and are planning to do so.Ninja72 (talk) 22:59, August 15, 2020 (UTC)

Updating information

Barry is one of the 7 survivors of the original multiverse. Can admins update his status and all the other paragons whose pages are locked (if any). (Jman321 (talk) 07:46, January 18, 2020 (UTC))

And if Barry is one of the characters who is allowed their Earth-1 pages to continue post-Crisis without an Earth-Prime page, can we remove "(Earth-1)" from his name? I think the Barry who's a main hero of the Arrowverse that became a paragon that transcends from Earth-1 to Earth-Prime should be THE "Barry Allen" that doesn't need to disambiguate, while the disambiguation page should be renamed "Barry Allen (disambiguation)."

About Earth Prime

Should we say that Barry's home universe is currently earth prime without changing the title since he technically is still the earth one incarnation while still living on earth prime? Lordpkeravrium (talk) 20:56, January 23, 2020 (UTC)

I think we should change the title to just plain Barry Allen and rename the disambiguation page to Barry Allen (disambiguation) because this is the most important version of Barry in the Arrowverse as the main protagonist of the first direct spinoff of Arrow, and his show has way more episodes than the 90's Flash. SeanWheeler (talk) 06:36, January 28, 2020 (UTC)

I agree with that, but they said that since they are both the main characters of their own shows both should have parenthesis.Ninja72 (talk) 14:31, February 9, 2020 (UTC)

So this guy should have his Earth designation just because of one season from the nineties? Iris West was listed in the 90's main cast but typing her name alone redirects to the Iris West-Allen of Earth-1. SeanWheeler (talk) 23:00, February 12, 2020 (UTC)

That is a little bit different, since that Iris was in only one episode and never appeared again.Ninja72 (talk) 23:04, February 12, 2020 (UTC)

Well, Earth-1 Barry is on his sixth season while Earth-90 Barry ended after one. Earth-1 Barry has made many appearances on Arrow and brought Supergirl's Earth-38 into the Arrowverse, and was mentioned across all shows. Earth-90 Barry was just there for Elseworlds and Crisis on Infinite Earths and a small cameo in Welcome to Earth-2. Earth-1 Barry was a paragon who's now a part of Earth-Prime. Earth-90 Barry died as an expendable double. We all know which Barry is THE Barry Allen. SeanWheeler (talk) 18:47, February 13, 2020 (UTC)

Like I said, I agree, but it was their decision.Ninja72 (talk) 18:54, February 13, 2020 (UTC)

Barry Paragon of Love

Barry as The Paragon of Love should be included in character template under Codenames--MarkMcG978 (talk) 22:14, April 29, 2020 (UTC)

I have just added that to the page so you're welcome MarkMcG978

This page should be called Barry Allen, not Barry Allen (Earth-1)

Earth-1 Barry is easily the most referenced and thought-about version of Barry Allen. Sure 90's Barry is also the star of his own show but that show went on for only one season and was 20 years ago, and he is dead now. Basically, the vast majority of people on the online and on this wiki who would end up on Barry Allen's page would be looking for Earth-1 Barry Allen. Also as you can see on this very talk page there are already 2 other people who are thinking this exact same thing. Also I made a poll here and so far the majority of people agree the page should just be Barry Allen.

The worst thing that could happen if Earth-1 Barry's page was called Barry Allen is that someone would arrive on it looking for another Barry and then get there by clicking the hypothetical "for other uses, see Barry Allen (disambiguation)" that would be at the top of the page. I think having this happen sometimes is definitely worth how it would be easier and simpler to type [[Barry Allen]] instead of [[Barry Allen (Earth-1)|Barry Allen]] every time when linking to this page. Wikifan988 (talk) 23:46, June 3, 2020 (UTC)

I agree. This is the Barry Allen that's the star of the Arrowverse. Earth-90 Barry was only retroactively included in the Arrowverse multiverse with Elseworlds (or Welcome to Earth-2 if you count freeze-frame cameos), and Crisis on Infinite Earths showed that just about everything DC made is connected to the Arrowverse multiverse. Not to mention Earth-1 Barry has made 166 appearances while Earth-90 Barry has only made 29 appearances. And other Earth-1 characters that made more appearances than their alternate Earth counterparts didn't need (Earth-1) in their titles. SeanWheeler (talk) 04:40, June 6, 2020 (UTC)

Barry's Introduction

Should Nora WestAllen be included in Barrys introduction as Barry being her father as it includes other family relationships

Removed a piece of information.

At Barry's powers section under the power of Superhuman Longevity i removed this piece of text According to Abra Kadabra, a villain from the 64th century, he is still alive and an active hero that deep into the future I did so because i don't think this was ever confirmed and we know Barry isn't alive anymore in Thawne's future. Also Jay Garrick is living proof that the aging of Speedsters isn't slow enough to allow them to live for thousands of years. If i had to guess I'd say Barry could live twice as long as the average human at best.

So I'd keep this information removed unless someone can add a reference for the episode in which Abra actually confirms him to be alive in the 64th century.The Prince of Shafts (talk) 21:39, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

Unnecessary parts of Barry's intro

Some parts of the very first paragraphs on Barry's page have almost nothing to do with Barry, like Deathstorm and Caitlin. Should they be removed? - May 25, 10:40 EST

Add Barry Allen/The Flash's greatest weakness (yes, it's canon)

OK, I have a proposal. Include Madvocate's [work] discussing The Flash as part of the Arrowverse wiki. His words are true (most of the time) about who Barry is, and I think this wiki has done a great disservice just ignoring that. Especially since it's canon; like, a thing brought up from time to time in the show itself. I think I have something that can make his critcism of Barry Allen into believable canon. See here:

Weaknesses

"Oh you train?! Really?! I thought your powers just dropped out of the sky! Need a peanut gallery? Can you not do anything without your wife in your ear? I don't think that you can go more than nine hours without some sappy motivational speech. Your team betrayed you. You needed them, and they weren't there."

"If you're trying to get a rise out of me, it's not gonna work. Are you serious, man? Felicity invented quarterbacking. I'm not doing this. I'm not doing this. You know, if you really knew how to use my speed, I never could have laid a finger on you."

—Oliver and Barry, indirectly discussing Barry's greatest weakness.^[src]

File:Arrow shoots flash.png

Oliver managing to shoot arrows on Barry's back at normal speed, the most infamous example of Barry's biggest weakness as The Flash

• Lack/Lapses of strategic thinking/common sense: By far Barry Allen/The Flash’s biggest weaknesses in subsequent altered timelines after the original attributed to his tragic upbringing developing him into an emotionally damaged nerd. [insert source of Elseworlds, Part 1, Flashpoint, and the episode with Metal Bully Man] Barry, especially in his early days, constantly ran in blind without thinking and misused his speed against his foes [insert source of Flash vs. Arrow]; especially when in times of need. Getting himself needlessly injured and letting meta-humans he could’ve stopped with simple manuvers get away, this weakness has caused innocents as well as the people he loves to get hurt and killed - along with himself - multiple times. This weakness is often exploited by tactical geniuses such as Captain Cold [insert episode with Cisco's brother debut] and Hartley Rathaway, the latter of whom rightfully called Barry a “total moron” for these actions [Sound and the Fury]. Even longtime ally Oliver Queen has called Barry out on his inept thinking while on the field twice [Flash vs Arrow and Elseworlds, Part 1]. For the longest time, Barry was discouraged from ever improving from these actions due to several factors. The first, was the loving encouragement of Team Flash keeping these weaknesses at bay at times when it really mattered [insert every season 1-5 episode here]. The second reason was due to many lessons in attempt to correct this being not of his liking [Flash vs Arrow] or from people he would later despise [Who is Harrison Wells and Trajectory]. The last and most important factor was due to his negative emotions growing in “the last nine years watching the people [he] love[s] suffer and die” [A New World, Part Four] blinding Barry from thinking logically. However, Barry has proven over time to improve in his strategic thinking as he gains more experience. Executing more tactical maneuvers and eventually using his speed as well as his emotional appeal to his advantage [insert Smart Flash Season 8], Barry has mostly gotten over this weakness especially in his later Flash years; with some exceptions of course [insert Armageddon Episode 2 and Negative Forces Arc].

SuperBen 1000000 (talk) 07:18, 27 May 2023 (UTC)